Used boat choices/questions

[4n6fisher]

I am looking for a little advice on a used boat purchase. The compromise with my wife was to get something we could do boat in camping with, either going to the remote boat access locations or staying on the boat itself. It also needs to be "cool or vintage" style. Currently the towing vehicle would be a 98 Tacoma 2wd with v6, so limited by the 3500lbs towing rating, but a newer/bigger truck is in the near future so I do not want that to limit the options too much.
My fishing would be mainly larger lakes, Puget sound, Columbia river, etc. so I thought something in the 18-20' range, maybe a foot or two longer if aluminum since they are lighter.
I have read through a number of the older threads here so it looks like an outboard gives easier maintenance/winterizing etc. but there does not seem to be as many of those boats.
My budget at this point would be <$5,000, ideally a little less so there was some left over for extras like downriggers, fish finders, etc. depending on what came with the boat.
I have been searching craiglist including E.WA and Portland areas, there seems to more and better pricing options in Portland for some reason. I have been mainly looking at cuddy cabins so we could sleep aboard, but I open to other options.

Does anyone have recommendations on brands of boats or motors to tha they would recommend or stay away from? Glassply and Glasspars seem to be around as well as Starcraft (for aluminum) seem to be the most prevalent.
What would be other areas to inspect or be concerned about other than hull condition, transom, engine compression and floor soundness?
I do not want too much of a project, while I could figure out how to fix most items, I just do not have the time. Some general cleaning, TLC and new cushions would be within a normal expected scope of any older boat so I am not looking for a completely pristine vessel.

Thanks for any tips or purchasing advice.

Omar

[18ftTrophy]

Hey there 4n6fisher, I think you have the right idea with Glasply. To help with your decision check out there web site at Glasply.org. There is a lot of information on this site and they are always ready to help and give advice. I have a 17' Glasply and love its seaworthiness, That is one reason the USCG used them in the day. If you do go with a GP 1978 is when they started using fiberglass stringers. Just my 2cents worth.

[Larry3215]

I wish you good luck on your search! I was there back when too I will offer two tips....

1) You cant camp on a small boat if you're over 6 years old

2) I loved my old 21' Glassply cudy but it was HEAVY. Really really heavy. No way you can tow a 20' glassply cudy with your truck or pull it up a steep ramp. Think 4 wheel v8.

Old boats in good shape that people want to sell cheap are rare - but sometimes you get lucky, so dont give up!

All the ones we bought over the years - including the Glassply - ended up taking a LOT of time and money to get into shape and keep in shape. It has to be a love thing or it will drive you nuts

[stryker17]

one thing to remember is fiberglass is very heavy compared to an Aluminum, with that budget you might look at the Spokane area, we bought one there years ago and they seem to be a little less costly our last boat an Alumweld stryker we bought out of Portland, be ready to do a little traveling to get one in your price range........

[4n6fisher]

18ftTrophy thanks for the tips on the stringers and the recommendation.

Larry3215 good points about the weight of those vessels and the continued maintenance, especially on an older boat. I was not so sure about sleeping on board, seems like the boat starts to get too big to make it comfortable. Might be used more to getting at remote shore locations to set up the tent. Cuddy would be nice if the wife wanted to sleep in while I fished in certain locations.

Stryker17, I have been leaning aluminum for the weight issue, but they are harder to find locally (unless you have extra $$), does seem like Portland or Spokane (or other E WA areas) have a few more options. Nice thing about east side boats is less chance for salt exposure, maybe reducing some corrosion/rot/mildew issues. I am including all surrounding areas in the search, just not sure about buying one from Canada with the customs, etc.

Anyone have an opinion on Starcraft aluminum boats? There are a few in Portland, looks like riveted hulls so maybe some weeping.
What about outboard vs I/O? I think I would prefer and outboard, but did not know how much of a deal breaker it should be if I find the right looking but but it is I/O. A few recent rebuilds with low hours on I/O boat seem like a better condition than an older outboard, but not sure about the how the regular maintenance and other costs compare.

Thanks for all the advice and opinions.

[18ftTrophy]

I disagree with Larry3215 about camping onboard. I have done it with my ex when I had a 19' Searay and was very comfortable and fun. The Searay was a Merc. I/O. It all depends on what you want to do with a boat. I have always owned a 3/4 ton 4X4 so size and weight of the boat was not a problem. You do have to remember a boat is a hole in the water where you put your money!!!
As far as I/O vs outboard, there are more parts with I/O, but can be easier for someone with mechanical skills to work on. Good luck in your search.

[Larry3215]

IO's add some extra maintenance considerations.

Mainly the cooling system -the heat exchanger and risers. You must maintain them properly or risk filling the engine with water.

You're also usually adding a blower system for venting fumes in the engine compartment which also adds an extra step in the starting procedure. You need to run the blower for 5 minutes every time before you start the engine.

There are also extra fire extinguisher requirements because of the enclosed engine compartment plus you're almost always giving up floor space inside the back of the boat. They are almost always more difficult to work on too as they are at least partly buried under the deck of the boat.

[4n6fisher]

Thanks for the inputs guys, more food for thought.

18ftTrophy, yes BOAT=Break Out Another Thousand! I figured I needed to spread out my money, just going to tackle now, the boat shops must need some!

It does seem like upgrading the truck first might be a good option so I do not have to limit my choices too much, but I am not in a hurry so I will keep my eyes out for the right fit.

[4n6fisher]

Toyota and boat

1969 starcraft

I went with the 1969 Starcraft Chieftain 22' aluminum hull. The bad is the floor is a little soft and the transom is getting soft (from the top down so still good around main engine). So that is a little more of a project than I was initially looking for, but me and my wife are just suckers for a project rather than shelling out more money. The good is the engine ran good and was rebuilt with only one season of use, then sat for a year. Fired right up and sounded good, reportedly the 9.9 hp Honda 4 stroke is also in good running order.
the boat was not too heavy (1600#), but the trailer is a little overkill, very heavy duty steel channels. It towed OK behind the Toyota and stopping was not too bad. It did tend to start fishtailing a little over 60, especially coasting down hill.
As many good boat stories there was a near miss on a potential disaster driving home from Portland. Just getting into Olympia start hearing a funny noise, luckily right at an exit so I veered off, the tire had expanded and was rubbing on the wheel well with the bolts taking off large chunks of rubber and it was very hot. Stupidly I first started trying to bend the wheel well out of the way (not completely realizing that the tire was crowning and could blow any minute). Unsuccessful we looked up the nearest Les Schwab, just a mile away closing in 20 minutes. We limped our way there and, we do not sell 16" tires anymore, they are obsolete? Luckily they did have a couple used ones that they swapped out and 15 minutes later we were back on the road only out $100 total.
So if you suspect bad tires, just stop and get new ones right away to avoid disaster on the road.
I will add some more images as I start digging into the repairs and asking for advice.

[Larry3215]

The fishtailing is a tongue weight issue - not enough tongue weight or too much. You will need to move the boat forward or back on the trailer or redistribute weight in the boat if you had a lot of gear in it while towing.

Thats actually not as hard as it sounds. Just move the winch forward a couple of inches and then pull the boat forward using the winch and re-check the tongue weight. Repeat as needed until you have close to 10% of the total weight on the tongue.

If the boat needs to go back, just tie it off to something strong enough with heavy rope and pull the trailer forward a couple of inches.

You can also launch the boat, move the winch as needed and re-load the boat and check the weight.

[Bodofish]

Fish tailing is most certainly caused by the CG being too far aft, AKA to light on the tongue or the trailer is not sitting at the correct level. When the truck and trailer are sitting on a level road the hitch should be a few inches lower than the pivot or axel location on the trailer, never ever above.
My guess is the boat just out weighs the truck by so much it doesn't have a chance. The boat is steering the truck and there is only one way to fix that. Boat on the trailer fishtailing is very bad juju, one good whip and it could toss your truck right off the road and follow up right behind it. Towing is very serious business.
Cheap insurance is to rent a UHaul truck for $29.99 a day plus miles.

[4n6fisher]

Pretty sure it was too little weight on the tongue as the boat was completely empty with the motor being the only real weight. I will look into moving the winch forward, or pack all the gear into the front. Thanks for the tips Larry3215, I will need plenty more.

Anyone have thought about hitting the boat ramp with this boat and truck (Tacoma V6 2wd)? I guess it may depend on the condition and slope of each ramp. The Edmond's sling is the closest launch to me anyway do I might go that way the first few times.

[Hunter757]

Make sure when you move the wench stand forward that you measure the rear rollers. They look very close to the transom now you might have to move them to just measure twice. The boat does look like it rides to far aft on the trailer but that is what I see. Now it is on rollers and I have seen some boats roll off the trailer so be careful when you loosen the wench to move it if the boat is still on the trailer it very well may roll of the back end so be careful!

Congrats on the boat and hope you and your family have great times ahead!!! Keep it simple and plays safe, yes steep ramps if wet will most likely give you trouble but you won't know till you try a few ramps out. Try not to overload your boat with extras this will help driving down the road and keep your speed on the safe slower side no rushing!

[Bodofish]

The problem is not the ability to pull the boat or put it in and take it out. The problem is being able to stop. It makes no difference what kind of brakes the trailer has and it doesn't matter if the truck is rated for 6 or 9 thousand pounds, with a truck like yours you're looking at around 1500 safely. It's not even a half ton truck. Judging by the way the truck was sitting with the boat attached, you'll be replacing suspension parts before you know it. As for balance on the trailer you want approximately 2/3 of the load ahead of the CG. With a trailer it's easy, the CG is at the axel. I've had my come to Jesus moment with the boat and trailer. I started out with an undersized rig. Driving through Snohomish, the light turns yellow and a car blow through the red. I jammed on the brakes as hard as I could and the boat shoved me through the intersection without slowing even a mile an hour. I missed the car by inches. That was traveling at 25MPH. The problem goes up exponentially with speed. I'm deadly serious about talking to the UHaul guy and renting a truck for a day if you want to put the boat in. $29 a day plus miles is cheap compared to the alternative.
Good luck and be safe.

[Larry3215]

I think you will probably be ok launching and loading as long as the ramp is not really steep or slick - moss, seaweed etc. Is your Tacoma an automatic or stick? Stick will be more difficult.

However - your listed weight above of 1600# cant be right. Im guessing your actual weight is probably more like double that plus the trailer.

You can easily check that by finding someplace with a scale that will let you weigh it. It might cost a few bucks or they may let you do it free. There was a sand and gravel place near me that used to do it free, but they went out of business a few years ago.

[Larry3215]

The problem is not the ability to pull the boat or put it in and take it out. The problem is being able to stop. It makes no difference what kind of brakes the trailer has and it doesn't matter if the truck is rated for 6 or 9 thousand pounds, with a truck like yours you're looking at around 1500 safely. It's not even a half ton truck. Judging by the way the truck was sitting with the boat attached, you'll be replacing suspension parts before you know it. As for balance on the trailer you want approximately 2/3 of the load ahead of the CG. With a trailer it's easy, the CG is at the axel. I've had my come to Jesus moment with the boat and trailer. I started out with an undersized rig. Driving through Snohomish, the light turns yellow and a car blow through the red. I jammed on the brakes as hard as I could and the boat shoved me through the intersection without slowing even a mile an hour. I missed the car by inches. That was traveling at 25MPH. The problem goes up exponentially with speed. I'm deadly serious about talking to the UHaul guy and renting a truck for a day if you want to put the boat in. $29 a day plus miles is cheap compared to the alternative.
Good luck and be safe.

I disagree a tiny bit - properly sized surge breaks that are working correctly and in good condition make all the difference in stopping.

The trick is keeping them in good condition and working properly. Even stainless disc breaks and pads deteriorate rapidly - especially used in salt. Drum types dont hold up well at all even with wash kits that you actually use.

Bottom line is - be careful and plan for a newer bigger truck

[Bodofish]

If the truck doesn't weigh enough to put adequate pressure on the master cylinder it won't work. I'm not talking about slowly putting on the brakes to come to a controlled stop, they always work then. In an emergency things are a lot different. It only takes a split second of losing traction and they won't activate and the boat is driving you down the road out of control. Even with antilock brakes in an emergency with a small truck you're screwed, that 1/10,000 of second when the antilock kicks in is enough to drop the pressure. It's just the way they work. Surge brakes only work when you have a properly sized vehicle and the trailer is set up correctly.

[4n6fisher]

A bigger truck is in the future. I will just keep to low travel distances until then or use a friends truck. All I could find (nada and iboats) said the boat was either 1600 or 2000 lbs (I think the 1600 was without the motor), but the trailer is heavy.
5 speed stick so I, but I am adapt at using the ebrake staring up hills with a load, probably automatic on the new one.

Bodofish, good thought about renting a truck if a friend is not around. Even if I am driving carefully you never know what will be going on around you.

[Larry3215]

My 20' aluminum open bow boat has a bare bones hull weight of 1650 lbs. Your hull weight has to be well over 2000 + motor +trailer +gear+fuel+etc.

The towing weight on my boat is about 3200-3300 lbs with everything on board. Im pretty sure you are going to be north of 4000.

[4n6fisher]

http://boatspecs.iboats.com/Starcraft_M ... p/66b86124" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;, here they say 2000lbs I think it includes the motor. Nada boats had the weight listed as 1600.
Guess I will need to find a scale, to get the truth as trailer is unknown, no stamped numbers where it is supposed to say trailer gross weight, but it can hold 6500lbs so a little beefy for this boat.